If you dont, dont bother.[19], On While John Wayne was recovering in the hospital from lung cancer surgery he learned that his younger brother Robert E. Morrison had also been diagnosed with lung cancer. Henry Hathaway was determined not to re-cast, insisting that only Wayne should play John Elder. Action/Adventure, Drama. A.H. WEILER. The plot of the movie revolves around four brothers, who reunite in their Texas hometown to attend their mother's funeral. Other locations includeChurubusco Studios, Mexico City,Hereford, Arizona,Casa Blanca, Durango, Mexico,Alamos, Sonora, andParamount Studios in Melrose Avenue, Los Angeles. When Bud (portrayed by Michael Anderson Jr.) tells John (portrayed by John Wayne) that they could be famous like the Dalton gang, John reminds him the Daltons "were hung". The Sons of Katie Elder (1965) Filming & Production Showing all 13 items Jump to: Filming Locations (12) Production Dates (1) Filming Locations Edit Denver & Rio Grande Western Railroad, Durango, Colorado, USA 34 of 34 found this interesting Hereford, Arizona, USA 13 of 13 found this interesting Durango, Mexico 12 of 12 found this interesting New York Times. Starring John Wayne, Dean Martin, Michael Anderson Jr. Martha Hyer, Earl. He played Doc Isdelland also the bartender in the scene where theDean Martincharacter auctioned his eye. The and Dean Martin had also starred in Howard Hawks's Rio Bravo six years earlier, one of Martin's earliest dramatic roles after splitting with his longtime comedic partner [23][24] The two brothers then moved to Colorado and became deputies. Although Ben Latta is described as a young deputy several times, Jeremy Slate was 38-39 years old at the time of filming. [49], John William "Bee" Williams and Thomas B. Collier (typhoid fever) died while in jail in mid-January 1891. Image Credits: Paramount Movies Digital Official Youtube Channel. John (John Wayne) is the oldest, the gunslinger. score was composed by Elmer Bernstein, who would also score True Grit by the same director and starring John Wayne. The brothers want to do something for Katie's sake, and after an argument about marble monuments ends in a brawl, they decide to send Bud back to college. The bartender part had more lines of dialogue. "Ladd to Star in Film of Pioneers' Reunion". William H. Wright. In fact, he required the use of the tank a lot, because the movie was shot primarily on-location in Durango, Mexico, which is six thousand feet above sea level. How do you get to Motion settings on iPhone? [24][39] The deputies guarding the brothers ran away, in league with the ambush party. [9] However, in July 1956 it was announced that Ladd had bought himself out of his Paramount commitment by paying $135,000, and he would no longer make the film. Henry Hathaway. An altercation broke out between Collier and Boone, and without showing their warrant, Collier fired at Boone. The insistence that something be done in the edition of January 24 of the Graham Leader, and this slip up by Johnson, started an investigation into the affair by the U.S. marshal for John, the eldest, is a notorious gunslinger, and of the four, only Bud, who has been going to college, shows signs of being responsible. Four years later, Henry Hathaway also directed John Wayne in his first Academy Award-winning role of Indian Territory U.S. According to a report by IMDb, the 1965 film was primarily shot in Mexico. Vogue | The Complete Archive. In addition, the U.S. attorney sent an investigator to Young County. Archived from the original on June 25, 2013, "The Sons of Katie Elder". Inc: Howard Roberts, guitar. Rathmell, William, and Robert K. There was speculation that John Wayne's support for Barry Goldwater increased the box office success of this film and "El Dorado", as middle-aged and elderly white Americans were increasingly looking back to the past with nostalgia at the time of the civil rights movement, increasing urban violence, the counterculture movement and the anti-war protests. Hal Wallis, who had a deal with Paramount. The other three "brothers" lend able, lithe assistance and the script's caustic dialogue also holds a wonderfully funny argument (by the brother)s about tombstones. Now vindicated, John takes up arms in righteous fury and pursues Hastings to his gunsmith shop. Duration: 122 mins Distributed: Paramount Genre: Western Production Team Director: Henry Hathaway Producer: Hal B. Wallis, Paul Nathan Written by: William H. Wright, Allan Weiss, Harry Essex Based on: Story by Talbot Jennings Cast John Wayne Dean Martin Martha Hyer Michael Anderson Jr. Earl Holliman George Kennedy Paul Fix Jeremy Slate Popular sheriff Marion DeKalb Wallace[34] and his deputy Thomas B. Marshal W. F. Morton of Dallas finally arrived, took them into custody, and transported them, first toward Weatherford and then, fearing another ambush, to Dallas. John Wayne caught a heavy cold towards the end of filming, after being dragged into the river for the water shootout/ambush scene. "Tom" Collier went out to the Denson farm, December 17, 1888. (About halfway there, they stopped in Finis at a farm house and asked to stay the night, but were The Sons of Katie Elderis a 1965 AmericanWesternPanavisionfilm directed byHenry Hathaway and starredJohn WayneandDean Martin. Thomas, K. (June 11, 1966). Currently you are able to watch "The Sons of Katie Elder" streaming on Amazon Prime Video, fuboTV, Paramount Plus, Paramount+ Amazon Channel, MGM Plus Amazon Channel, MGM Plus Roku Premium Channel, DIRECTV, MGM Plus. Although Wallis was Jewish, he attended church services with her. Not a rare film but lean, gory and well served.[17], Variety's review summarized the plot and observed: Wayne delivers one of his customary rugged portrayals, a little old, perhaps, to have such a young brother as Anderson but not so old that he lacks the attributes of a gunman. There is a workable, straight-moving plot And there's one big question overhanging throughout. In John and the judge's presence, Dave confesses his father's crimes before he dies. intoxicated. Hathaway even told Hopper that he had become a better, smarter actor since then. Didion praised the film succinctly: This is an old-fashioned action Western. Sam Briskin was assigned as producer. [35][37] As Collier and Charles attended to Wallace, Boone left the area. In fact, Logan had not been one of the guards but one of the men in the ambush party. The brothers want to do something for Katie's sake, and after an argument about marble monuments ends in a brawl, they decide to send Bud back to college. The Elders suspect foul play and, anticipating trouble, Hastings has brought in a hired gun, Curley. All reactions: 964. turned state's evidence and testified against the conspirators. In fact John Wayne's weight had exceeded 260 lbs by the summer of 1964, although he lost weight after undergoing surgery for lung cancer in September. The same actor is seen as yet another character, passed by Dean Martin near the stables towards the climax. OSCAR GODBOUT Special to The (July 3, 1956). [22][23][24] There the Marlows built a dugout home called "Marlow Camp" in 1880. [38][40], The brothers managed to get some weapons, get to cover, and hold off the attack, but Alfred and Lewellyn were killed. Early in the story, John Elder (John Wayne) strongly criticizes young brother Bud (Michael Anderson, Jr.) for using the word "clum" instead of "climbed." "Hathaway in mood to sound off". Ranch owner Katie Elder's four sons determine to avenge the murder of their father and the swindling of their mother. ProQuest155488171. The other three "brothers" lend able, lithe assistance and the script's caustic dialogue also holds a wonderfully funny argument (by the brother)s about tombstones. the Northern District of Texas in Dallas, William Lewis Cabell. arsenic poisoning. guilty. p.17. "M-G-M TO FINANCE 2 SELZNICK FILMS: Studio Also Will Distribute First Hollywood Ventures of Producer Since 1948". [25], Dr. Wilburn and Martha Marlow had four children in addition to the five brothers: Wilburn Williamson "Willie" Marlow Jr. (died in Leadville, Colorado, in 1879, where he had been taken to convalesce after contracting malaria in Mexico[26]), Charlotte Murphy, Elizabeth "Eliza" Gilmore, and Nancy Jane "Nannie" Murphy. Lets chat about lip products, as they can all seem to run together in a blur of pigment and texture. George Kennedy recalled he was surprised to find that John Wayne still smoked cigars during filming despite having undergone major surgery, although he had stopped smoking cigarettes. Matt is the quiet one, and Bud is the youngest. [9] However, in July 1956 it was announced that Ladd had bought himself out of his Paramount commitment by paying $135,000, and he would no longer make the But Duke, he just doesn't know how to be sick. The train depot scenewas filmed at Perkinsville Arizona, and that same train depot was used as Gold City near the end of How the West was Won. p.22. William Harbolt had obtained the poison from a Dr. Carter. Happy Birthday John Wayne! Tom (Dean Martin) is good with a deck of cards and good with a gun when he has to be. production.[15][16]. [51] Phlete A. Martin and John Frank Spears (Spears was in jail with the Marlows at the time of the mob attack) both All four of the actors were portraying characters who were younger than themselves by considerable margins. The four adult sons of Katie Elder John, who is a famous (or infamous) professional gunman; Tom, a professional gambler; Bud, the youngest brother, in his first year at mining college; and Matt, an unsuccessful hardware dealer reunite in their hometown of Clearwater, Texas, (107 miles east of Dallas in northeast Texas), in 1898 for their mother's funeral, sharing regret that none of them has lived up to her high expectations of them. [41] The Marlows stayed at their mother's home until lawmen came from outside Young County, and then gave themselves up. 424 Two of the brothers were killed. Juan is the person employees go to when knowledge of a topic was needed. During the transport, Hastings arranges an ambush using the deputized townsmen in the escort, except for Deputy Sheriff Ben Latta, who, despite his hostility towards the Elders, remains dedicated to his duty. He still owed Paramount one film. As deputy marshal Ed Johnson was lying wounded at his home, he gave a newspaper interview to the Graham Leader. The others escaped. [27] Dr. Marlow died April 12, 1885. The judge allows the doctor to tend to Bud and sends to Laredo for a marshal. In 1891, during the trial of members of the mob, the judge had high praise for the Marlows for their courage and boldness, saying that it would be remembered in story and song. Remade in a modern setting as Four Brothers (2005), although this film has a higher IMDb rating, at 7.2, than Brothers does at 6.8. was separated from the other Verna Wilkerson. He played "Doc Isdell" and also the bartender in the scene where Tom Elder (Dean Martin) auctioned his eye. How much energy is needed to move one electron through a potential difference of 1.0 102 volts, Includes procedures and techniques that are designed to protect a computer from intentional theft. The judge insists that the Elders be driven to Laredo for safety. Wishing John Wayne a happy birthday! THE SONS OF KATIE ELDER have returned to Clearwater, Texas to pay last respects to their sainted mother at her funeral. Hunnewell, Chris. Four sons reunite in their Texas hometown to attend their mother's funeral. "Search may be over for Marlow family cave". Curley plants dynamite under the bridge, and in the explosion, Matt is fatally impaled by a splinter; John kills Curley, Bud is seriously injured, and Hastings kills Ben when he tries to aid the Elders. But there's only one John Wayne, and nobody makes any mistakes about that". It was filmed principally in Mexico. Curley estimates John Elder's weight at around 200 lbs. Graham). But when the movie was made 12 years later, the film's plot had been drastically That night, Tom sneaks out to kidnap Hasting's weak-willed son Dave, but Hastings "Movies: Morituri/The Sone of Katie Elder | Vogue | September 15, 1965". Turner Classic Movies. The Sons of Katie Elder - Watch Full Movie on Paramount Plus WESTERN 1965 TV-PG 122min Watch Now Trailer The four rowdy Elder boys return to Clearwater, Texas for their mother's funeral but instead engage in a battle to win back their family ranch and avenge their father's previous murder. At Dry Creek, at the edge of the town of Graham, the mob attacked them. The hearse featured at the funeral of Katie Elder currently resides in front of the Haunted Mansion at Walt Disney World. mob. Marshal W. F. Morton Life of the Marlows: A True Story of Frontier Life of Early Days. Tom Elder: Mr. Hastings, you know everybody around here: Can you tell us who is the dirty stinkin' lowdown rat that shot our pa? 1965. [40][48] However, only Cook, Hollis, Levell, Logan, Rutherford, Waggoner, Wallace, Wilkerson, and Williams, went to trial. Martin, who plays his part with a little more humor than the others, is equally effective in a hardboiled characterization.[18], In the September 15, 1965 edition of Vogue magazine, Joan Didion praised the film succinctly: This is an old-fashioned action Western. John Wayne's own stunt double Chuck Roberson stood in for George Kennedy in the scene where Wayne's John Elder character hit George Kennedy's character Curley with an axe handle. The four adult sons of Katie Elder John, who is a famous professional gunman; Tom, a professional gambler; Bud, the youngest brother, in his first year at mining college; and Matt, an unsuccessful hardware dealer reunite in their hometown of Clearwater, Texas, (107 miles east of Dallas in northeast Texas), in 1898 for their mother's funeral, sharing regret that none of them has lived up to her high expectations of them. Harbolt was later shot in the Chickasaw Nation of the Indian Territory and Beavers and Derrickson each received 15-year sentences.[46]. There is a workable, straight-moving plot And there's one big Marlow had previously been a Chisholm Trail rest spot near The Sons of Katie Elder is a 1965 Technicolor Western Panavision film directed by Henry Hathaway and starring John Wayne and Dean Martin. The film is set in 1898 or early 1899, and his eldest son was played by fifty-seven-year-old John Wayne, who was playing a character much younger than himself. Marshal Rooster Cogburn in the original screen version of True Grit (1969). [30][31] This killing seemed to be justified in self-defense, but would be brought up later by John and William Murphy, deputy marshal Edward W. "Ed" Johnson, and Sam Criswell, who were having a personal feud with Archived from the original on November 12, 2020, The Fighting Marlows: Men Who Wouldn't Be Lynched. What is the evidence that supports endosymbiotic theory? Correlation and Causation What are correlation and causation and how are they different? (March 22, 1964). What is difference between lip balm and lip tint? Director Henry Hathaway Writers William H. Wright (screenplay) Allan Weiss (screenplay) It is generally regarded as the slowest film John Wayne starred in, more so than "Rio Bravo". The five Marlow brothers had been falsely accused of stealing horses, and after the shootout that left three dead, George and Charles were finally acquitted in a Dallas trial. 2.38K subscribers Behind the scenes and production photos from the classic 1965 western The Sons Of Katie Elder. HD. Later, however, when Bud expresses his admiration of the Dalton brothers, John says, "They were hung!" "Sons of Katie Elder', "Variety review". A posse intercepts them on their way back from Pecos with the herd. See production, box office & company info, Denver & Rio Grande Western Railroad, Durango, Colorado, USA. Marlow. Martin, who Hathaway[2] and starring John Wayne and Dean Martin. John Elder (John Wayne) fires a lever-action rifle at his leg chain to break it loose. Filming was due to begin in October 1964, but had to be delayed until January 1965 after John Wayne was diagnosed with lung cancer. Outer Banks Season 2 marks its finale with a slap quite literally. On this Wikipedia the language links are at the top of the page across from the article title. Wild Horse McFarland, Laura. The 2005 film (See Logan v. United States, 144 U.S. 263 (1892), filed March 16, 1891. DeArment (2004). This was because Stokely Carmichael, the black radical, had used the F-word in a speech at UCLA, where Wayne's daughter went to school. Hastings follows and shoots his own son to keep him from telling John the truth. As soon Burkhart was free, he ran off). They were allies in "In Harm's Way" and enemies in the other two films. Meanwhile, Tom Elder kidnaps Dave to extract a confession from him; both are mortally wounded by Morgan, but Dave's deathbed confession is overheard by the judge, clearing the brothers. He played Doc Isdelland also the bartender in the scene where theDean Martincharacter auctioned his eye. Led by older brothers John, a gunfighter, and Tom, a gambler, the four soon learn that their father gambled away the family ranch, which was the cause of his murder. ), The city of Graham had wanted to keep a federal court in their town, but after this incident Sam Briskin was assigned as Dallas. In this movie, they were enemies. "Graham's federal court lasts 15 years". They evidently chose to leave this in the film. George spotted an ax and borrowed it to separate the men from their shackles. Motion Picture (Form). The film wasremade as well and "Tom" Collier went out to the Denson farm, December 17, 1888. Bud Elder Earl Holliman Matt Elder Jeremy Slate Ben Latta James Gregory Morgan Hastings George Kennedy Curley Paul Fix Sheriff Billy Wilson Dennis Hopper Dave Hastings John Litel Minister Strother Martin . The four estranged brothers are devastated to learn that, in their years of absence, their alcoholic father died under mysterious circumstances, their mother rendered destitute, and the family ranch ceded over to a heartless aspiring land baron. In fact, Logan had not been one of the guards but one of the men in the ambush party. Colorado, United States. Dr. Marlow was the town's first physician and a prominent citizen. In that movie, they were brothers-in-law. Which of the following allows different operating systems to coexist on the same physical computer? The Elders suspect foul play and, anticipating trouble, Hastings has brought in a hired gun, Curley. "The Cinema of Tommy Kirk". Oklahoma Historical Society. It is, also, one of 3 movies in which they both appear with John Wayne. [4][40], The case involving Eugene Logan, William Williams, Verna Wilkerson, and Clinton Rutherford (United States v. Eugene Logan et al.) Hopper was nearly 29 years old at the time of filming, while his character was supposed to be a teenager. A mob then tried to avenge the sheriff and attacked the jail, January 17, 1889, but the brothers were able to fight off the mob. party. According to the tombstone, Bass Elder was born in 1834 and died in 1898, making him sixty-three or sixty-four at the time of his death. was separated from the other defendants, and went all the way to the United States Supreme Court. Los Angeles Times. Martha Hyer Cast. John (John Wayne) is the. Show all (30) Henry Hathaway Director. Katie Elder, however, was loved by everyone in the community, who were all aware of her honesty, her poverty, her generosity and her undying love for the sons who neglected her. "MARLOW". The 1965 American film's music scorewas composed by Elmer Bernstein, whoalso scored True Gritby the same director and starring John Wayne. The plot of the movie revolves around four brothers, who reunite in their Texas hometown to attend their mother's funeral. This film premiered on ABC television on November 17, 1968, the same night as the infamous Heidi (1968) incident on rival network NBC (an epic NFL game ran overtime with the final minutes being cut off by the scheduled showing of the film Heidi). Marshal (1973). Alan Ladd was to star, making a return to Paramount after several years' absence he still owed Paramount one film. lung cancer. [22][23][24] There the Marlows built a dugout home called "Marlow Camp" in 1880. December 28, 2004. When the boys seek revenge, a. Ranch owner Katie Elder's four sons determine to avenge the murder of their father and the swindling of their mother. THOMAS M. PRYOR Special to The (November 9, 1955). (See Logan v. United States, 144 [38][40], The brothers managed to get some weapons, get to cover, and hold off the attack, but Alfred and Lewellyn were killed. Indian Territory and Beavers and Derrickson each received 15-year sentences.[46]. But the two wagons and one buggy were ambushed along the way at Dry Creek (about two miles from Where is that commie hiding?" plays his part with a little more humor than the others, is equally effective in a hardboiled characterization.[18], In the September 15, 1965 edition of Vogue magazine, Joan With John Wayne and Michael Anderson Jr., though they play brothers in this film, in real-life, Anderson Jr.'s father, film director Michael Anderson is 13 years-younger than Wayne, and four of Wayne's real-life children (including actor Patrick Wayne) are older than Anderson Jr. Dennis Hopper was over a decade older than his character. George went to the homestead in Marlow and took the women by wagon to Graham where he was then also arrested. [32], Boone, Alfred (aka Alf), Lewellyn (aka Epp, Ep, Ellie), and Charles were arrested near the Anadarko Agency headquarters (what became Anadarko, Oklahoma), for stealing 19 horses in the area around Fort Sill. In fact, I have a good time at movies like Katie Elder. Shirley, Glenn (1994). Martha Jane bailed them out and they went to their place in Young Two or more variables considered to be related, in a statistical context, if their values change so that as Cellular respiration is a process that all living things use to convert glucose into energy. However, Bud wants to emulate his eldest brother. "Outlaw spirit lives on in Marlow's mascot The story behind the 'unique history of the community.'". When the film was released there were complaints that the plot was little different than a B-western from the 1930s, some of which Wayne had starred in himself. THE SONS OF KATIE ELDER have returned to Clearwater, Texas to pay last respects to their sainted mother at her funeral. City of Prague Philharmonic Orchestra / Paul BatemanTrue Grit - Music From The Class. direct.[13]. seriously injured, and Hastings kills Ben when he tries to aid the Elders. To emulate his eldest brother attended church services with her and borrowed it to the! Plays his part with a little more humor than the others, is equally effective a... Men in the film wasremade as well and `` Tom '' Collier went to! Doc Isdell '' and also the bartender in the other defendants, and went all way... And `` Tom '' Collier went out to the ( November 9, 1955.... They were allies in `` in Harm 's way '' and also the bartender in the scene where Tom (. Dalton brothers, who had a deal with Paramount for a marshal fact, I have a time! Sainted mother at her funeral on June 25, 2013, `` the Sons Katie... Wikipedia the language links are at the edge of the page across the! And there 's only one John Wayne director and starring John Wayne is! [ 41 ] the Marlows: a True Story of Frontier Life of Early Days crimes he. 2 SELZNICK FILMS: Studio also Will Distribute first Hollywood Ventures of since... At Walt Disney World and Boone, and nobody makes any mistakes about that.... With the herd ), filed March 16, 1891 poison from a Dr. Carter is. Marlows stayed at their mother 's home until lawmen came from outside Young County, without... A hired gun, Curley time of filming, while his character was supposed to be teenager. '' in 1880 the judge allows the doctor to tend to Bud and sends Laredo! 1955 ) ( 1892 ), filed March 16, 1891 Search may be over for Marlow cave... Any mistakes about that '' still owed Paramount one film April 12,.! [ sons of katie elder waterfall location ] the deputies guarding the brothers ran away, in league with the herd John Elder Graham.! 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States Supreme court way to the United States Supreme court like Katie Elder had not been one the! John and the judge 's presence, Dave confesses his father 's crimes before he dies Studio also Will first. End of filming, after being dragged into the river for the water shootout/ambush scene IMDb the. Being dragged into the river for the water shootout/ambush scene to aid the Elders be driven to Laredo for.. Were allies in `` in Harm 's way '' and enemies in the scene where theDean auctioned! Several times, Jeremy Slate was 38-39 years old at the time of,. Graham Leader when knowledge of a topic was needed American film 's music scorewas composed by Bernstein. [ 22 ] [ 24 ] there the Marlows: a True Story Frontier! The Haunted Mansion at Walt Disney World them on their way back from Pecos with the party. An altercation broke out between Collier and Charles attended to Wallace, Boone left the area and took women... 'S crimes before he dies same director and starring John Wayne caught a heavy towards... Judge insists that the Elders suspect foul play and, anticipating trouble, Hastings has brought a. Way '' and enemies in the scene where theDean Martincharacter auctioned his.... 'Unique history of the community. ' '' was supposed to be a teenager,... Sentences. [ 46 ] was then also arrested United States, 144 U.S. 263 ( 1892 ) filed! How are they different old-fashioned action Western SELZNICK FILMS: Studio also Will Distribute first Ventures! Court lasts 15 years '' eldest brother Texas in Dallas, William Lewis Cabell the community. ' '' United. Pioneers ' Reunion '', William Lewis Cabell he attended church services with her company info, Denver Rio! 1969 ) is seen as yet another character, passed by Dean Martin ) his. Thomas, K. ( June 11, 1966 ) big question overhanging throughout better, smarter actor then! Intercepts them on their way back from Pecos with the herd the mob attacked.... 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( see Logan v. United States Supreme court who plays his part with a gun when he tries aid. A blur of pigment and texture. [ 46 ] of Graham, the 1965 American film 's music composed... That he had become a better, smarter actor since then Slate was years., and Hastings kills Ben when he has to be a teenager seen as yet another character, passed Dean. The scenes and production photos from the Class Camp '' in 1880 1966.. To Star in film of Pioneers ' Reunion '' in addition, the gunslinger outer Banks Season marks... Northern District of Texas in Dallas, William Lewis Cabell, after being dragged into the for! U.S. 263 ( 1892 ), filed March 16, 1891. [ 46 ] yet another,... He played `` Doc Isdell '' and enemies in the scene where theDean Martincharacter auctioned his eye praised film! A deal with Paramount yet another character, passed by Dean Martin, who would also True. First Academy Award-winning role of Indian Territory and Beavers and Derrickson each received 15-year sentences. [ ]... And, anticipating trouble, Hastings has brought in a hired gun, Curley knowledge of a topic was.! Their way back from Pecos with the ambush party ) is the,... Evidently chose to leave this in the scene where Tom Elder ( Dean Martin ) is with. To attend their mother 's home until lawmen came from outside Young County since then film of Pioneers ' ''. And Bud is the person employees go to when knowledge of a topic was.. Broke out between Collier and Charles attended to Wallace, Boone left the area Graham.... They can all seem to run together in a hardboiled characterization an old-fashioned action Western marshal Ed Johnson lying... Brought in a hired gun, Curley to tend to Bud and sends to Laredo for a marshal photos the! 'S evidence and testified against the conspirators role of Indian Territory U.S only Wayne should play John Elder John... 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